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Tax Law Rankings

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diversity

Joined: 24 Nov 2006
Posts: 11
Tax Law Rankings
Wed Mar 28, 2007 07:10 AM
Q: I guess you are an alumni of NYU taxation law?

A: Current student, NYU, LL.M. (International Tax).

Q: I heard that prestigous LLM programs usually have bias upon international students, is that true?

A: No.

Q: About how many international students were there in your class?

A: We were 28 in my program. But we had no special classes only for international students - in all of them there were GTPs and JDs. I would say that in a big class like International Tax I & II (70 students), 35 could have been foreigners. In other courses, like Partnership Tax (50 students), there were only 3 foreigners. Conclusion: it depends on the courses you take.

Q: Any scholarship available?

A: Yes. Apart from the general scholarships granted by NYU (read other threads and you will know which ones are offered), there is the Wallace scholarship for ITP candidates.

Q: If yes,what would be the most important criteria of an candidate?

A: No idea.


Thank you very much Ivan! Glad to have you here to help us know more about the program～ Hope to see more information from you on the forum:)
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ivan2006


Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 312
Tax Law Rankings
Fri Mar 30, 2007 04:11 PM
New 2008 U.S. News Tax Rankings
The new 2008 U.S. News Law School Tax Rankings are out and available on-line here. U.S. News ranked the Top 25 this year (with ties); here are the Top 10:

1. NYU (#1 last year)
2. Florida (#2)
3. Georgetown (#3)
4. Northwestern (#4)
5. Harvard (#5)
6. Miami (#5)
7. UCLA (#7)
8. Boston University (#7)
9. Texas (#15)
10. San Diego (#9)
10. Virginia (#11)
10. Yale (#11)
The biggest upward moves are:

+6 Texas (#9)
+3 Loyola-L.A. (#16)
The biggest downward moves are:

-6 USC (#21)
-5 U. Washington (#18)
-4 Stanford (#13)
-2 Denver (#21)
Last year, U.S. News ranked the Top 21 schools. Five schools that were unranked last year made this year's Top 25: Duke (#14), Penn (#18), Boston College (#21), Columbia (#21), and Florida State (#21).

One school that was in last year's Top 21 dropped out of the rankings this year: Chicago (#17 last year)

The 12 schools with graduate tax programs included in the rankings are the same as last year:

1. NYU (#1 last year)
2. Florida (#2)
3. Georgetown (#3)
4. Northwestern (#4)
5. Miami (#5)
6. Boston University (#6)
7. San Diego (#7)
8. Loyola-L.A. (#10)
9. SMU (#9)
10. U. Washington (#8)
11. Villanova (#10)
12. Denver (#10)
Loyola-L.A. is the only graduate tax program to move up (+2) in the rankings; Denver (-2), University of Washington (-2), and Villanova (-1) all moved down.
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Publius00


Joined: 21 Feb 2007
Posts: 25
Tax Law Rankings
Fri Mar 30, 2007 05:05 PM
The new tax rankings are surprisingly anticlimactic. I was expecting something like UF and GLC trading places, along with some shifting below that. Really, there is nothing new (except for Loyola's small climb and UW's move down--which seem rather insignificant).
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CRSL

Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 2
Tax Law Rankings
Mon May 28, 2007 11:51 PM
Im new here, and im thinking of doing the Taxation Program (LL.M) at the University of Miami, can someone tell me if its a good program and if i have good chances of finding a good job after the program?

[Edited 29 May 2007 by CRSL]
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MiamiGrad

Joined: 25 Aug 2007
Posts: 1
Tax Law Rankings
Sun Aug 26, 2007 10:16 PM
I graduated from the LLM program at Miami and think that it is a great program. It's challenging and the faculty is incredibly well known. Yes, it doesnt have quite the reputation as NYU or Gtown but it is considered the best for International Tax. NYU's international tax LLM is for international students. Also, if you want to practice in Florida or the Southeast in general, it carries a lot of weight because the alumni in the area. Hope this helps!
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Rob Attorney

Joined: 28 Aug 2007
Posts: 8
Tax Law Rankings
Wed Aug 29, 2007 04:38 PM
I have an LL.M. in Tax from NYU.

Just add that I think Ivans comments were all quite accurate. The NYU LL.M. program (and the law school J.D. and in general) has been ranked #1 in tax (and top 6 law schools generally) for many decades. That is for good reason.

Someone asked is admission competitive. Of course it is at the consistently #1 ranked program and being in NYC where many law firms and corporations readily aborb such graduates (I started with Wall Street firm out of NYU). However, if you are serious about it and have decent law school grades or special tax background or excelled in tax courses at a good law school in their J.D. program and/or have some good tax professor recommendors ... THEN GO FOR IT (apply). A good J.D. GPA is best way for acceptance, but some of those other factors might compensate some for a less than stellar GPA. There ARE EXCEPTIONS to the generalizations on GPA at most law schools if other factors make a candidate look attractive based on dedication, work or study background in the relevant area, strong/respected recommendations, etc. Anyone who can get in and afford NYU LL.M. and does not do so, if interested in tax law, really needs to sit and do some serious reflecting (to put it mildly).

Concerning University of Florida Law School. It is a great law school and college (ranked Tier 1 law school) and its outstanding tax program dates back to at least the 1950's when the tax faculties at UF and NYU co-authored leading tax texts and moved between to two law schools to teach (Professors Friedland and Stevens and others). The smaller size of Gainesville (mentioned by someone) is irrelevant to the quality of that LL.M. degree, although NYC is better in terms of convience and connections to employment in N.E. USA.

Between UF and U. of Miami ... U. of Miami has come a long way in recent decades and apparently they have a good LL.M. Tax program ... but clearly University of Florida is the one nipping at NYU's hills and consistently rated #2 for TAX LL.M for a long time. So if you don't go to NYU and can get in U.F. that would be an excellent choice, as would George Washington with its D.C. location.

It should be noted that University of Florida is even offering a rare J.S.D. degree in Tax Law. That is a post-LL.M. doctorate of law. I don't know anything about that program but it does tend to show how far UF is in Tax Law Study. It was the first and only such program I heard of to offer further tax law study and degree BEYOND the LL.M. (Tax).

Rob
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diversity

Joined: 24 Nov 2006
Posts: 11
Tax Law Rankings
Thu Aug 30, 2007 05:11 PM
Thank Rob for your detailed information! Do you mind telling us whether you got your LLM degree right after graduation (JD?) or after several years of working experience in Tax?
Besides, I notice that Harvard Tax Law program ranks five (which is also quite good) but few people comment on it. How is this program of this prestigous school, in terms of reputation and job placement? Does the fame of "Harvard" make it harder apply to than the No.1 NYU? Thank you very much for your sharing!!
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Rob Attorney

Joined: 28 Aug 2007
Posts: 8
Tax Law Rankings
Thu Aug 30, 2007 11:55 PM
ANSWER: I went directly from JD graduation into LL.M. (tax) at NYU. I do not know it to be a fact but have heard that NYU (like many of the MBA programs now) has a preferance now for those with some experience coming back for the LL.M. in tax. That was not a factor when I attended.

I don't know anything about the Harvard LL.M. in tax except that it did not exist until pretty recently, so its sort of an unknown quantity as far as their LL.M. (Tax) program goes.

While Harvard is big name school, NYU ranks close behind as a J.D. law school and clearly way out in front for LL.M. in tax. Based upon that fact, I would assume that NYU would get more applications and be first choice for more lawyers wanting the LL.M. in Tax. I don't know how many Harvard admits to their program, perhaps its very small? Unless the Harvard program is very small, I would limagine the NYU Tax LL.M. admission would be harder to get (smaller % accepted). Again, I do not have actual facts and this is just my assumption.

As far as jobs go, I would imagine Harvard LL.M. graduates do not have too much trouble getting jobs. However, when it comes to tax lawyers, I think most big firms and those in the know would prefer to get an NYU LL.M. Tax graduate from the long-time #1 tax law program in US.

Rob
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taxllm

Joined: 12 Jun 2007
Posts: 25
Tax Law Rankings
Fri Aug 31, 2007 06:18 AM
Harvard LLM program is for those that want to teach law. Harvard doesnt have a tax llm program, rather it's a concentration and you have to write a thesis with faculty approval. The rankings yoiu are referring to are prestige of law schools in certain specialities at the JD level (e.g., dispute resolution, trial advocacy, etc.) There are also rankings specifically for tax programs which isnt hard to find on other posts here, or on the internet.
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dwbutler4

Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 1
Tax Law Rankings
Tue Sep 11, 2007 07:34 PM
i am a 2nd year eyeing the possibility of going after a llm in taxation. I already will have considerable debt from law school.... is there a list that shows the cost of attendance of llm schools?
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taxllm

Joined: 12 Jun 2007
Posts: 25
Tax Law Rankings
Tue Sep 11, 2007 07:46 PM
No idea, but i've heard UF is practically free

[Edited 11 Sep 2007 by taxllm]
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CRSL

Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 2
Tax Law Rankings
Wed Oct 10, 2007 09:15 PM
I decided to go for the UF LLM Taxation program, i`m a foreing lawyer... my question is... is it difficult to get in to the UF LLM program?
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aspen

Joined: 12 Dec 2007
Posts: 5
Tax Law Rankings
Thu Dec 13, 2007 08:37 PM
Ivan, i've learned a lot from your answers in this thread. thank you very much. can you shed more light on the difference an LLM in taxation and an LLM in international tax? I don't have any prior tax background, and which speciality is more advantageous, in your view, to land a job in big US law firms? thanks for your input.
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PJP

Joined: 29 Jan 2008
Posts: 14
Tax Law Rankings
Wed Jan 30, 2008 02:44 AM
For Rob Attorney and Ivan, or those who know the answers,

I am currently working on my JD (tier 3) and interested applying to the tax program at the top 3. I didn't do particularly well in my first year but I am receiving decent grades in my 2nd year and also in tax courses. It seems like people who went to NYU Tax LLM were already biglaw candidates before starting their LLM.

1) Do you know anyone who is not doing as well after NYU Tax LLM but with lower ranked JD? I want to know what happens to people with a lower ranked JD or didn't do well enough for biglaw but still somehow managed to get into NYU Tax LLM.

2) Well since there's no guarantee that I will get into NYU Tax, I'd like to know the answer to the same question (#1) for UF or GULC as well if you know.

3) If I want to have some working experience in tax after law school, what kind of work experiences would be good to have for applying tax llm, especially at NYU? I am concerned that not many employers will hire me to do any of their tax work right after JD, only having finished several tax courses in law school. What if I cannot find a position in tax law?

4) I'd like to know the career potentials and options as a tax lawyer (with LLM) at law firms and at corporations. Is switching between the two possible? What is the earning potential b/w the two and how are the working hours?

Thank you so much!

[Edited 30 Jan 2008 by PJP]
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ourj

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
Posts: 3
Tax Law Rankings
Mon Feb 18, 2008 01:28 PM
I have a few questions:

1. When you refer to Washington is that Seattle or St. Louis?
2. Is the list of the top 12 programs posted the only American schools that admit American students to tax llm programs?
3. As a B student at a tier 2 law school which LLM programs are likely out of my range as far as getting accepted?
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PJP

Joined: 29 Jan 2008
Posts: 14
Tax Law Rankings
Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:17 PM
I have a few questions:

1. When you refer to Washington is that Seattle or St. Louis?
- It's University of Washington in Seattle.

2. Is the list of the top 12 programs posted the only American schools that admit American students to tax llm programs?
- If you're referring to the list in this thread, yeah they are American schools but they admit international students too.

3. As a B student at a tier 2 law school which LLM programs are likely out of my range as far as getting accepted?
- I am wondering about the same question. Some posters told me that you can still get into GULC or UF being a B student as long as you do really well in tax courses (maybe take around 3 tax courses) and get some tax experience such as internship or something.
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ourj

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
Posts: 3
Tax Law Rankings
Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:10 AM
I have a few questions:

1. When you refer to Washington is that Seattle or St. Louis?
- It's University of Washington in Seattle.

2. Is the list of the top 12 programs posted the only American schools that admit American students to tax llm programs?
- If you're referring to the list in this thread, yeah they are American schools but they admit international students too.

3. As a B student at a tier 2 law school which LLM programs are likely out of my range as far as getting accepted?
- I am wondering about the same question. Some posters told me that you can still get into GULC or UF being a B student as long as you do really well in tax courses (maybe take around 3 tax courses) and get some tax experience such as internship or something.




1. Thank you for the clarification.
2. Are those 12 the only 12 programs out there or are there others?
3. I wonder if having an accounting degree and having passed the CPA exam will increase my chances of getting in to one of the top schools?
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LinkedS

Joined: 24 Feb 2008
Posts: 78
Tax Law Rankings
Mon Feb 25, 2008 04:42 PM

3. I wonder if having an accounting degree and having passed the CPA exam will increase my chances of getting in to one of the top schools?


I can only imagine it helps but to what extent I am not sure
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att333

Joined: 29 Feb 2008
Posts: 4
Tax Law Rankings
Sat Mar 01, 2008 02:51 AM
Hi, I'm a tax llm student at NYU this year.

1. I don't think I understand your question. I think doing the program would only make you worse off after doing it as opposed to not doing it, if you wanted to practice in an unrelated area of law, say criminal law for example.

I know people that wouldn't have been considered for biglaw before having done the program, that were offered jobs at biglaw afterwards. However, simply being hired doesn't necessairly mean you can make partner. I think a lower JD school may become an issue at some point, unless you're really good bringing in clients. Also, as an aside, the BigLaw market for new intl and M&A tax associates is doing poorly this year. Estate Planning generally requires 2-3 years work experience doing estate planning.

2. Didn't apply. Keep your hopes up. I know someone that got into NYU but not GULC. It's just about how well you market yourself and your capabilities in your personal statement and resume - and how much INTEREST you show in the program.

3. I didn't have tax work experience either. I had law clerk and judicial externship experiences. I, as well as other people I know, have employers that offered to pay our air travel expenses to interview us despite the lack of experience. Again, its how well you market yourself and communicate your thoughts.

4. I also interviewed at a few in house legal departments. If it's a large corporation, it may pay starting associates on par with say a Big Four Accounting firm in NYC. I wouldn't expect anything much higher than 115K for a tax department in house with no experience. If you move up to Senior VP & Ass. GC, you might be in the high 200s. No profit sharing potential, and mandatory retirement at 65. Remember you're just a corporate expense, if you go in house.
For Rob Attorney and Ivan, or those who know the answers,

I am currently working on my JD (tier 3) and interested applying to the tax program at the top 3. I didn't do particularly well in my first year but I am receiving decent grades in my 2nd year and also in tax courses. It seems like people who went to NYU Tax LLM were already biglaw candidates before starting their LLM.

1) Do you know anyone who is not doing as well after NYU Tax LLM but with lower ranked JD? I want to know what happens to people with a lower ranked JD or didn't do well enough for biglaw but still somehow managed to get into NYU Tax LLM.

2) Well since there's no guarantee that I will get into NYU Tax, I'd like to know the answer to the same question (#1) for UF or GULC as well if you know.

3) If I want to have some working experience in tax after law school, what kind of work experiences would be good to have for applying tax llm, especially at NYU? I am concerned that not many employers will hire me to do any of their tax work right after JD, only having finished several tax courses in law school. What if I cannot find a position in tax law?

4) I'd like to know the career potentials and options as a tax lawyer (with LLM) at law firms and at corporations. Is switching between the two possible? What is the earning potential b/w the two and how are the working hours?

Thank you so much!
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att333

Joined: 29 Feb 2008
Posts: 4
Tax Law Rankings
Sun Mar 02, 2008 03:36 PM
ABA Survey says median in house for no experience is $70K... but if you stay on it goes up to median in house for The GC / CLO is high 200s to low 300s, but up to 700K for the largest corps (>$10B revenue.)


www.abajournal.com/weekly/top_in_house_lawyers_mak…
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socceroo

Joined: 02 Mar 2008
Posts: 1
Tax Law Rankings
Mon Mar 03, 2008 04:03 PM
Hi all,
I´ve been admitted to the International Tax Programs at UF and at Michigan. I have not decided yet where to go in autumn (in fact I am very irresolute,....)
What do you think about these programs? I´d be really grateful for any help.
Thx
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Crash


Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 16
Tax Law Rankings US News 2008
Mon Apr 07, 2008 08:17 PM
Law Specialty Rankings 2008: Tax Law

Ranked in 2008
1 New York University
New York, NY
2 University of Florida (Levin)
Gainesville, FL
3 Georgetown University
Washington, DC
4 Northwestern University
Chicago, IL
5 University of California--Los Angeles
Los Angeles, CA
6 Harvard University
Cambridge, MA
University of Miami
Coral Gables, FL
8 Boston University
Boston, MA
9 University of Virginia
Charlottesville, VA
10 University of Michigan--Ann Arbor
Ann Arbor, MI
University of Texas--Austin
Austin, TX
Yale University
New Haven, CT
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UK Tax CA

Joined: 11 Apr 2008
Posts: 1
Tax Law Rankings US News 2008
Sat Apr 12, 2008 10:07 AM
Can someone help this Chartered Accountant (UK) who want to do Masters in Tax and come back to Europe/Asia and work for US employers or Work in USA. My background: I do not have a first degree, but I am a chartered accountant and a chartered tax advisor. I have 5+ years of tax experience. I presently work in house for a large pharmaceutical company. I have the following questions.

1. Is it possible to do an LLM in USA without a law degree but based on the chartered accountant qualification and tax experience?

2. If can only do a masters in taxation - where can I find ranking? Can someone guide me on which is the well known US MST program in Europe?

3. Any opinion about DU Graduate tax program?

Many thanks
UK CA
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patyprato

Joined: 05 May 2008
Posts: 3
Tax Law Rankings US News 2008
Tue May 06, 2008 01:19 AM
I was wondering which will be the best LL.M.s for a latin lawyer who wants to live in Caliornia and -find a job there -after finishing the LL.M.???
My GPA is 3.5 and I need a partical scholarship or loan.. Any toguhts on the matter?
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rafadavi

Joined: 23 Jan 2008
Posts: 65
Tax Law Rankings US News 2008
Tue May 06, 2008 08:01 PM
I was wondering which will be the best LL.M.s for a latin lawyer who wants to live in Caliornia and -find a job there -after finishing the LL.M.???
My GPA is 3.5 and I need a partical scholarship or loan.. Any toguhts on the matter?

Hello, sure you should try Berkley or UCLA, 3.5 gpa is not so strong for a top School but anyhow is all about your credentials 2 or 3 years of previous work after law school thats a fine school, good luck
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