http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492 en Did anyone turn down Harvard's offer ? - LLM GUIDE Discussion Board Fri, 28 Apr 2006 15:28:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17492 Did anyone turn down HLS' offer ? if yes, which school have you chosen ? Fri, 28 Apr 2006 16:58:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17494 I sent a letter to Harvard stating as follows: "Thank you for your letter offering admissions. Due to the large number of highly qualified schools offering me graduate admissions for the 2006-2007 academic year, competition was intense. Unfortunately, I regret to inform you that your offer of admissions was not successful. I wish Harvard Law School the best of luck in its future endeavors." Fri, 28 Apr 2006 17:07:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17496 hahah good one JW. I'm turning down Harvard's offer and going to Stanford's IP LLM. I spoke with Jeanne Tai to thank her and to let her know of my decision a couple of days ago. I will confirm this by Monday. BTW, Jeanne is very very nice. I don't know if it was a good call, but I don't regret it, since I would really like to focus my studies in IP/tech law. Anyway, it was definetely a tough choice to make (I also had a 7500 grant from HLS and nothing from SLS). good luck to you all! Fri, 28 Apr 2006 17:36:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17497 JW: You are a dude... That one's a classic Fri, 28 Apr 2006 18:58:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17505 JW, man, that one was great!!! That´s one of the best posts ever placed in this site! (And some people say that people here doesn´t have sense of humor...) Fri, 28 Apr 2006 20:22:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17510 JW, just loved it. You go man! Fri, 28 Apr 2006 21:13:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17513 well, a nice, polite letter goes a long way.... :-) Fri, 28 Apr 2006 22:30:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17519 Jw... Is it a joke or you really did it ? Fri, 28 Apr 2006 23:04:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17521 Well, those are the exact terms of the rejection letter they sent to us. So, why not to use the same beautiful and polite words to try to explain how really sorry one of the applicants is for rejecting such valuable offer. This is the best idea ever! Fri, 28 Apr 2006 23:20:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17522 I turned Harvard down and will be going to Yale instead. Sat, 29 Apr 2006 08:22:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17535 JW - that's hilarious! Sat, 29 Apr 2006 17:30:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17542 Jw, please tell me you actually sent the letter hahah Sat, 29 Apr 2006 23:40:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17552 Hi there! I also turned down HLS' offer....It was not an easy thing to do, but I was offered a Grotius Scholarship in NYU and I accepted it because I want to focus exclusively on international law. Living in New York city also influenced my decision... I agree with Asterion: Jeanne Tai is very, very nice! The fact that she called me on the very same day that I had to make my decision made it even harder for me to say no to HLS!!! Regards, Luciana Sun, 30 Apr 2006 10:01:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17561 I'm turning harvard down for yale Sun, 30 Apr 2006 17:30:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17573 jw, way to go man! That was right out of the top league. Mon, 01 May 2006 07:52:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17586 Hi there, JW, loved your response! I turned down Harvard (and Yale btw) for Chicago. Jess Mon, 01 May 2006 15:00:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17598 Hey Jess, this is a bit unusual. Can you explain us why? I turned Harvard down for Stanford. Tue, 02 May 2006 23:06:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17653 i will turn down harvard for oxford. Wed, 03 May 2006 19:23:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17684 I'm considering turning down Harvard. Wed, 03 May 2006 19:27:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17687 siggy, for which reasons are u turning HLS'offer down ? and which school would you attend instead of HLS ? Wed, 03 May 2006 21:38:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17695 Turn down Harvard for Oxford, because I have friends who have attended both, and friends were unimpressed with Harvard's LLM, feeling it was too much like another year of law school. I'm not looking for another year of law school. Besides, I'm interested in jurisprudence and common law constitutional history, Oxford's stregnths. Sat, 06 May 2006 03:07:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17775 I just turned it down today. I got a full ride to G-Town, so I felt hard-pressed to spend $70,000 on Harvard. This is especially true since I was specifically interested in Tax (one of G-Town's specialties). Mon, 08 May 2006 03:41:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#17818 I just turned it down today. I got a full ride to G-Town, so I felt hard-pressed to spend $70,000 on Harvard. This is especially true since I was specifically interested in Tax (one of G-Town's specialties). Rematore, where are you from? Sun, 14 May 2006 07:35:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#18027 I love this thread! Sun, 02 Jul 2006 21:15:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19533 I turned down Harvard for Columbia. Go New York! Tue, 11 Jul 2006 22:20:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19731 hi! I am going to be applying for my llm for the session starting 2007 and I am amazed at how many of you guys have turned Harvard down. What I want to know is how much of a genius do you have to be to get an offer to begin with? Wed, 12 Jul 2006 12:28:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19746 You certainly don't need to be genius. What you need is good grades, good recommendations, good reasons for applying to HLS, and some good luck. It's much easier if you're applying from a country from which there are fewer applicants (Finland, for instance). Competition between, say, Indian, or Brazilian applicants is fierce, or so I've heard. Thu, 13 Jul 2006 09:32:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19776 Between India and Brazil?! That's bizarre! and really helpful since I am Indian. And there are scores of people who apply from here and get through so yey for me! Thu, 13 Jul 2006 12:00:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19779 Not between India and Brazil, but between Indian applicants, for instance, or between Brazilian. Basically you will compete with other Indians, and there will be many. But you don't who will be admitted, so you just have to apply and see. Try to see it from Harvard's viewpoint (or Yale's). They receive possibly 90 applications from India. Will they admit all of them, and have an LL.M. program consisting mostly of Indian students. They want regional diversity. But why would you be any worse than any other applicant? Fri, 14 Jul 2006 13:37:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19823 That's right. From another standpoint, however, the case may be worse for the Finnish lawyer than the Indian or the Brazilian. They want regional diversity, right, but there are clearly "standard" and "peripherical" regions. They may admitt one Finish this year and another one a couple (or even several) years later. If the goal is to have the strongest global network - and believe me: it is! -, one Finnish or one Austrian or one Potuguese each three or four years is more than enough. But you need tons of Indians, Chinese and Brazilians. I am not sure that, as Toni says, they look for diversity on a single year basis, nor do I think that beign Finnish is a natural advantage. (BTW, Toni has outstanding credentials!). I also think that they decide within a broad and fluid set of standards - there are no "formal realizable rules". They try to build a sort of an "academic welfare function" from very different variables like grades, merit, background, region, etc. The result is obviously a bit "artistic", not to say arbitrary (and I guess also a bit bureaucratic-driven: admission offices have a LOT OF POWER). For instance, I'm from Portugal (a really small country - tiny, in fact!) and I know that another Portuguese was admitted to Harvard this year. Why is that? Is it rational to have two individuals from such a small country? Look, there are only three or four Brazilians, so it makes no sense (Brazil is at least 20 times bigger than Portugal). And it can't be a love for Portugal, since there were only three Portuguese in Harvard Law School in the last 30 years... Fri, 14 Jul 2006 13:53:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19825 My analysis was obviously simplistic, so thanks to Gar for his deeper one. His point about "diversity-in-the-long-run-and-in-many-areas" admissions seems correct. Additionally, I think we all agree that admission process for American law schools is somewhat mysterious. Only thing you can do is to get as many credentials as possible, write as good an application as you can, and hope for the best. You should also apply to variety of law schools: some of the top 6 schools, some of the top 14 schools, and possibly some top 25 schools. I'm sure you will be admitted to one of them. Bear in mind that there are many excellent law schools in the US, so approach the application process with an open mind. Cheers and good luck! -Toni- Fri, 14 Jul 2006 17:41:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19830 And please remember to customize your application to the particular school. You cannot send the exact same application (personal statement, letters) to Stanford CGP LLM and NYU International Law LLM. It doesn’t work. My 0,02 cents if I may: think about this whole project well in advance. Identify the weak points of your application and deal with it. Fri, 14 Jul 2006 17:49:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19832 T. and S. are right, I think. You can see the whole entreprise from this perspective: part of it is controlled by you and part of it is arbitrary. Your are responsible for the first part and that means a lot. So, do your best and pray for luck. Regards. Mon, 17 Jul 2006 17:21:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19899 What about connection? Will it be easier to get admitted if u know somebody in the admission office, or, know some one who is quite influential to their decisions? Wed, 19 Jul 2006 18:55:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19944 I TURNED DOWN STANFORD AND YALE FOR THE ALMIGHTY HARVARD LAW. FRIENDS AND EXPERTS TOLD ME IT WAS THE BEST DECISION I HAVE EVER MADE - THE BEST LAW SCHOOL AND THE BEST UNIVERSITY IN THE GLOBE - AND GREAT OPPORTUNITIES. JEANE TAI IS wonderful - looking forward to meeting her THIS FALL. http://ed.sjtu.edu.cn/rank/2004/top500(1-100).htm I LOVE HARVARD http://ed.sjtu.edu.cn/rank/2004/top500(1-100).htm Wed, 19 Jul 2006 19:33:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19946 I agree with llmwannerbe - you made a good decision. I was rejected this year - hope to apply next year. Wed, 19 Jul 2006 21:29:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19957 I agree harvard law - No.1 cambridge no. 2 Thu, 20 Jul 2006 09:31:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#19977 "llmwannerbe", "Queen4law" and "Londonkid"... 3 different profils, 3 messages... but only one student behind that I'm afraid ! Are you paid by Harvard Law School to post these messages ? Fri, 21 Jul 2006 15:15:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#20015 I believe Anna is right. The first message is the giveaway: shouting and that childish Harvard worshipping sound like a flame. I doubt any real H-students would post this kind of stuff. I don't think anyone here really disputes the fact that Harvard is the best university in the world, and the most prestigious. Harvard Law, however, has couple of drawbacks. It's rather huge, and the LL.M program, too, is big. And from what I've heard, its atmosphere is not to everyone's liking. In the US News rankings, or Leiter's, HLS has never been the number one. I think there are plenty of good reasons to choose HLS over Yale and Stanford, but you guys have yet to mention any of them. My list would be: international prestige (in Asia, for instance), number of courses offered (huge), strenght in international law and critical studies, to name but a few. Fri, 21 Jul 2006 17:26:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#20018 Academic resources, interdisciplinary horizons, critical theory, professional network and reputation. These are serious reasons to choose HLS. Also, Harvard is clearly the best in the world in Critical theory, while for instance though Yale is very good in Conventional Legal Theory, it is not as good as Oxford. Harvard is number one not only in particular fields, but in some "schools of thought". Having said this, NO DOUBT Yale law School is the best law school in the US and probably the world. (Not sure Stanford is better than Harvard - I really don't think so, but I would't be surprised with other views). Few individuals with academic ambitions would rightfully choose Harvard over Yale. (But it may be intelligent just to do that: for instance, if your dream is to work with Duncan Kennedy or Larry Tribe). For the record, I'm going to Harvard but Yale was my top choice. Still I am tremendously happy! Fri, 21 Jul 2006 23:53:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#20022 I agree with you. Yale is the undisputed number 1 in the US (whatever that means...). Harvard/Stanford...I don't know...can go either way, but since Stanford is in California... :-) !!! They are all great schools. Sun, 23 Jul 2006 14:36:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#20054 I am a Zambian student in the UK, planning to apply to Harvard, Yale and Cornell this year this year and I was wondering if those of you that were accepted for the LLM at any of these Law Schools could share some of your infinite wisdom on a couple of points: 1) What are the entry requirements. Do I have to get a First class pass or will a 2:1 suffice? 2) How difficult is it to get a fellowship at any of these? 3) What sorts of things do you put in your personal statement? ie what classifies as a good reason for wanting to study at Harvard, Yale or Cornell? I know that announcing that you've wanted to do Law since you were three years old wont quite cut the ice. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated. (First one to respond gets free cookies: LOL) Sun, 13 Aug 2006 10:45:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#20570 Hi there, JW, loved your response! I turned down Harvard (and Yale btw) for Chicago. Jess hey jess ! i'm new to the board u seem to know a lot abt LLM, i'm 4m india and would like to do an LLM in env. law in 2007..cud you plz give me a few pointers for LLM courses in and around chicago thanks Mon, 21 Aug 2006 22:59:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#20742 Nice ads. I turned down an offer from Havard so I can be at peace with my gf who was annoyed as she was offered admission in the lowest ranked Law School. She is better education than that offer at Havard, for Havard is one year, she is, .................... Mon, 21 Aug 2006 23:06:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#20743 :-) So which school did you go for? Mon, 16 Oct 2006 15:44:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#21586 hi guys. am from uganda. graduated with a first from the national university in my country and am country doing the BCL at Oxford. Am also in the process of applying to harvard for the 2007/8 programme. Regds to all in the same process, good luck to us all(but especially myself)! JW, i have never read a funnier post! Mon, 16 Oct 2006 15:45:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#21587 currently* doing (not country) Wed, 18 Oct 2006 14:41:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#21600 Jess is awesome. I loved the (btw) Yale thing as well. Just in case we wondering. Thu, 22 Feb 2007 14:37:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24839 I sent a letter to Harvard stating as follows: "To whom it may concern, Thank you for your letter of February 16. After careful consideration, I regret to inform you that I am unable to accept your refusal to offer me graduate admission. This year I have been particularly fortunate in receiving an unusually large number of rejection letters. With such a varied and promising field of candidates, it is impossible for me to accept all refusals. Despite Harvard's outstanding qualifications and previous experience in rejecting applicants, I find that your rejection does not meet my needs at this time. Therefore, I will assume the place at law school this September. I look forward to seeing you then. Best of luck in rejecting future applicants. Sincerely," Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:50:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24843 with that level of creativity (though influenced by jw from last year i fear) i suppose they will let u into class Thu, 22 Feb 2007 18:46:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24859 does this mean that Harvard is already sending out rejections? Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:24:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24862 No ... those entries are from last year, with the exception of the last two. Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:51:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24878 Jw... Is it a joke or you really did it ? Yes, JW told me he went to the Ave Maria School of Law instead (the international reputation is also important you know) Fri, 23 Feb 2007 20:42:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24927 Hey i was wondering if anyone could give me their opinion as im not sure what to do. ive not heard back from Harvard yet as to the outcome of my application but ive got a place on the LLM at UPenn on a full scholarship including stipend. if i got into harvard (BIG if) obviously id have to pay the full $70K. any views on what i should do IF i got into Harvard would be really appreciated. thanks. Fri, 23 Feb 2007 22:23:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24934 I'm biased because I'm from HLS, but I would seriously consider HLS and the many general and specific advantages of going there. Especially if you get a job in this amazing job market, the money won't be as relevant after one year, while you'll be an HLS alumnus and part of the global network for life. I believe this is a general opinion that's been voiced in this forum whenever someone is choosing between a lower-ranked school and a scholarship, and a higher-ranked school. Also, 55K should be liveable, and they have generous support for loans available if you don't have that kind of support from your home country. Sat, 24 Feb 2007 01:59:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24938 I agree with josepidal when he says about that between a higher-ranked school and a lower-ranked school, you should pick the highest-ranked one (although I would add the rankings to be taken into account are the ones related to your specific field of specialization). Although I think UPenn is a fine school, my advice would be different if you said that you want to specialize in corporate law and you had a scholarship from Columbia (for instance). Sat, 24 Feb 2007 06:13:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24941 To add, I might not even be inclined to look that closely at the specialization anyway. You only have two terms and can only take two to three subjects per term, and may well find that a unique subject like Law and Literature is the most memorable for you. My context is that I've seen a number of corporate law partners take questions from 1Ls along the lines of what subjects should they take. They usually answer that they should have some basic courses such as Corporations and Securities Regulation, but what's really important is to take the courses that one enjoys and are passionate about, since there are some subjects you just won't encounter in pratice. The grain of salt is that LLMs can be expected to be more focused, but even then, career counselors say that devoting 50% of courses to your specialization is usually good enough for employers, who understand the above context. Or, in addition to reputation in a particular specialization, you may want to meet a superstar professor in that field. For example, you may be attracted to Columbia for the additional reason that the author of one of the widely-used Securities texts (John Coffee) teaches there. Sun, 25 Feb 2007 00:39:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24970 Hmmm... Here are my 2 cents to the discussion: I think diversification is good as long as there is a certain level of coherence. For instance: if you are a corporate lawyer and, in addition to courses on Securities and Corporate Law you take some courses on finance or law and economics or even some seminar on hot topics, like a course like "Settling international business disputes with China", it can be regarded as something good. However, if you take a course on Counter-terrorism law or a course on the Trial of Jesus (I am not joking: this is a seminar offered by NYU this semester - and I have heard it is pretty interesting), you should be able to explain why you are taking these courses. On the other hand, you should be aware that if a peer of yours is taking more "marketable" courses, he could be in a more advantageous position. I can tell that in every single interview I made during the last 5 weeks, the interviewers asked me about the courses I took in the Fall term and the courses I am taking now. Sun, 25 Feb 2007 02:48:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24974 I've honestly had the opposite experience, and I even had a debate with a friendly Capital Markets partner on whether Laurence Tribe from HLS was better than his Constitutional Law professor, Erwin Chemerinsky. If you're not taking any marketable courses, then you have some explanation to do. However, if you're clearly taking them, you don't have to explain the odd course since I think they understand everyone needs a little variety. For example, if you're interviewed by an M&A partner and he sees that you took Tribe's class in HLS (Constitutional Law, with a waiting list of well over one hundred each year), I can't imagine that he'd ask why you didn't take another corporate class. Unique classes, by the way, are wonderful foundations to show a lighter side of yourself during an interview. You should welcome the chance to explain what those are all about. I'm just expressing what I've seen from HLS, though, including my classmates' experiences. Sun, 25 Feb 2007 18:43:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24991 thanks for ur posts guys Sun, 25 Feb 2007 21:08:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#24998 Cherrie, When did you receive notification from UPenn about the full scholarship? Thanks! Mon, 17 Dec 2007 22:28:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#37654 Hey folks, wow. It's been almost a year. I see that Etzmolch basically ripped off my idea for a "Letter of Rejection", which I posted to this thread at the beginning. But hey, I'm more about spreading my influence and ideas, so go dude! Tue, 18 Dec 2007 01:00:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#37657 jw, that was a great post indeed.... sure made me smile. What's up with you today, do tell. Thu, 20 Dec 2007 05:05:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#37752 mnementh: thanks for the note. I'm actually presently in law practice. I did graduate studies at Oxford this past year, and now am figuring out what to do next, possibly more graduate work, but this time in the U.S. Tue, 25 Dec 2007 17:49:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#37932 jw , i think it was an amazing rejection letter.... but i want to ask u guys here , what are the minimum requirements a student needs to have to get into oxbridge, yale or harvard? what are the marks u got that these univerisities accepted u... i would be applying for LLM next year, so it would be helpful if i get an answer to this. Fri, 07 Mar 2008 10:10:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#41914 Hi guys, would you turn down Harvard for Michigan? Michigan is said to have an excellent small program and seems to give a lot of attention to LLM students. "Harvard" has probably a better sound, but I am not sure about the actual quality of its LLM program/its attitude to LLM students. Fri, 07 Mar 2008 18:03:00 +0200 http://www.llm-guide.com/board/17492/last#41946 Maybe the sound of H is better for the individual in the long run.. Does it really matter what is being taught in this one year is better or worse at some place or other.. If someone that matters (lawfirms, employers, the general polity at large who might influence your fortunes) thinks H has a better sound, so be it! And for that small perceived difference in the teaching during one year - forget it!! there is the whole life in front.. and all the opportunity to learn (assuming learning is important.. I think many people will tell u there are mor important things).. Three cheers to the sound of H!!