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Harvard LLM vs. Oxford BCL
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Julie0606  
Joined: 01 Apr 2007 Posts: 6 |
Harvard LLM vs. Oxford BCL
I am looking for advice on the offer I should accept. My area of interest is comparative constitutional law/comparative criminal procedure. Harvard's con law faculty is amazing, but I have heard the Harvard LL.M program described as something of a "fourth year of law school", whereas Oxford's BCL program is said to be geared towards graduate students with more intensive courses and one-on-one instruction. Thanks for any advice you can provide.
Mon Apr 02, 2007 08:08 PM |
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| fg Joined: 02 Feb 2006 Posts: 329 |
Harvard LLM vs. Oxford BCL
Tricky. I was in a similar position a couple of years back. Although I don't have first-hand experience of either programme I have lots of friends who have gone through both and I did a US LLM. Personally I think the BCL is a superior program because it is an actual graduate degree with intensive tutorials that challenge your thinking. Also, Oxford jurisprudence faculty is unmatched in the world.Mon Apr 02, 2007 08:18 PM That being said, I decided to study in the US because its legal system was so different from my own and I thought of Oxford as being too conservative and "black letter" for me at the time. While I enjoyed my LLM this was largely for the experience living in NYC as opposed to the particular courses (which were good but probably not a patch on Oxford's graduate classes) I didn't like being lumped in with the JDs. At the risk of causing offensive to some who may be reading here I found many immature intellectually (although some had PhDs in other subjects many were only second year JDs whose thinking hadn't developed in a theoretical or critical way regarding law) and the people who really challenged my thinking were the other LLM students. The JDs seemed more keen to get good grades and get law firms jobs than engage in original thinking. All generalizations, I know, but those are my thoughts. |
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| vic82
Joined: 31 Mar 2007 Posts: 10 |
Harvard LLM vs. Oxford BCL
Very nice comments flygirl. They are insightive for those applying for next year LLM. I think many people who have done LLM in UK always say that it is vey intellectually stimulating because graduate students have separate classes +lecturers all have PHD in law which I understand is not the case in US. I dont know whether this is important to you, it can affect your decision
Mon Apr 02, 2007 08:24 PM |
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| fg Joined: 02 Feb 2006 Posts: 329 |
Harvard LLM vs. Oxford BCL
Glad I can be helpful.Mon Apr 02, 2007 08:36 PM I am not sure that the professors in the UK are better than the US professors. My professors at Columbia were outstanding (and many had UK doctorates) but there is a different way of talking about the law in the US. US professors, I think, on the whole tend to think more creatively about the law using other disciplines (such as literature, sociology etc) to inform their legal discussions. The UK is more conservative ("the law of X" as opposed to "the law and X"). Traditionally one hasn't needed a PhD in law to be an academic (unlike other disciplines) and I am not sure having one indicates you are more knowledgeable about your area. I do think having a PhD, however, means you are more likely to be theoretical. My comments were more about the quality of students - I imagine a BCL class would be at a higher level since all the students are graduates. [Edited by fg on 02 Apr 2007] |
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| fg Joined: 02 Feb 2006 Posts: 329 |
Harvard LLM vs. Oxford BCL
On the practical side, one thing I should point out is the resources are probably 10 times better at Harvard since it is a much wealthier, private institution than Oxford. This can make a huge difference on the day to day level (eg: wireless internet connection in your room etc etc). That being said, the individual colleges at Oxford can be extremely wealthy so it may not make a difference.
Mon Apr 02, 2007 08:48 PM |
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| ricey Joined: 12 Mar 2006 Posts: 58 |
Harvard LLM vs. Oxford BCL
flygirl, do the same comments apply to an Oxford MJur? (because I've heard they sometimes treat the BCL differently from the MJur)Sun Apr 22, 2007 01:49 PM |
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| exbcler Joined: 31 Jul 2006 Posts: 53 |
Harvard LLM vs. Oxford BCL
Jumping in here--the MJurs attend exactly the same classes and do exactly the same work (with some very minor modifications to account for the fact that not all of the MJurs are working in their first language) as the BCL candidates, so I would think flygirl's comments apply equally to them.Wed Apr 25, 2007 03:40 AM If you want a rigorous year, and would like to have your limits stretched, I say go for the BCL. I've heard good things about a comparative public law course that McCrudden runs for the BCL/MJur students--it doesn't run every year though, so try to e-mail the Law Faculty to check if that might be a consideration in your decision-making. One thing you might want to consider, if you're not American and intend to teach public/constitutional law in your home country, is that--as flygirl says--you would be doing courses with the JDs at Harvard. That means studying American constitutional law which, while fascinating in all its complexity, is somewhat idiosyncratic. |
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