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Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.

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smartguy


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 97
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Fri May 13, 2005 07:02 PM
Hey hey girls!
Don't forget about non-Russian message board members. I understand that we are all coming coming from the biggest country in the world and I am making a suicide act by promoting non-LLM rout to bar admission :-))) but let's respect our non-Russian speaking collegues and get back to professional discussion in English.
Damnl.. i sound like forum administrator now :-)
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seculf

Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 3
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Sat May 14, 2005 05:11 PM
Hi Smartguy: For a foreign lawyer without a LLM in US, he can't take the NY Bar Exam, but can take the California's, is that right? How can i get information from the California Bar Exam, any recommendatory website? Thanks!
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Nikolas


Joined: 09 Jan 2005
Posts: 120
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Sat May 14, 2005 05:21 PM
www.calbar.ca.gov/state/calbar/calbar_generic.jsp?… and www.calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/admissions/sf_legal-…

As a lawyer you will not have difficulties finding the relevant regulations :-)

Actually, if you do find them, please post them on this board, as I haven't...
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Nikolas


Joined: 09 Jan 2005
Posts: 120
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Sat May 14, 2005 05:23 PM
Actually I plan take the bar in New York, so I wasn't looking too thoroughly...
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smartguy


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 97
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Sat May 14, 2005 06:53 PM
calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/admissions/77sf.pdf

CA Bar allows ALL foreign attorneys to take its Bar exam. NY allows to take its Bar exam only to those law graduate whose legal tranining durationally and substantially equals to JD and the country of legal education is based on principles of common law (e.g. if you hold 3 years law degree from UK, Canada, Australia, NZ, Israel) If your law degree only satisfies one of these two requirements (e.g. at least 3 years long) then welcome to LLM, my friend.
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Nikolas


Joined: 09 Jan 2005
Posts: 120
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Sat May 14, 2005 06:58 PM
Thanks, smartguy!
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russian

Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 14
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Tue May 17, 2005 01:19 AM
this is very interesing info, smartguy.
i wonder how many of us are admitted in any jurisdiction?
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smartguy


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 97
Re: Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Tue May 17, 2005 06:02 PM
this is very interesing info, smartguy.
i wonder how many of us are admitted in any jurisdiction?

Russian,
That i don't know. All i know specifically about Russia that many of my classmates are practicing law without being admitted to Russian Bar. Although it doesn't seem to be a problem to take Russian Bar exam. It should be a "piece of cake" for you if you think about taking Bar exam in America :-)
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Tommy


Joined: 15 Apr 2005
Posts: 4
unbelieveable
Sat May 21, 2005 09:15 AM
Still cant believe what calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/admissions/77sf.pdf is saying, although it does not specifically mention the common / roman law issue. That completely changes everything. So, the way to go would be to break the first obstacle in CA. and move on to other US jurisdictions as we' d see fit? Hell of a tactic, Id say.

Another question, there was an attorney from Louisiana that posted here sometime ago, but I just cant find his insertion. Would Smartguy know what the bar requirements at the blue napoleon code state (Louisiana) would be? I know LA. operates through codes of procedure - civil/roman based.

Nice going smartguy, I must admit it, you have overcome yourself!

"É o relatório"
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Shumelka

Joined: 06 Apr 2005
Posts: 55
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Sat May 21, 2005 10:15 PM
I can answer this for smartguy.
I'm also a Russian attorney who considered a Louisiana LL.M some time ago. The director of an LL.M program told me that I can be admitted to practice law in Louisiana provided I'm a US permanent resident who obtained LL.M in LA.

As to your disbelief in California's opportunity, it's easy to prove smartguy's correctness. Check lawyers profiles in Lexis and you'll find lawyers from civil law jurisdictions admitted to practice law in CA. For instance, Olga Karasik, a Russian attorney passed Cal bar in 1994, but obtained her LL.M in 1996.
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james

Joined: 08 Apr 2005
Posts: 29
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Mon May 23, 2005 06:49 PM
Please be advised, if you have a 3 year LLB from an English (common law) jurisdiciton ie. Canada, UK, Australia, NewZealand, you will qualify to sit the NY Bar WITHOUT the need for a US LLM.
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olaf

Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 6
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Thu May 26, 2005 08:18 PM
All you smart guys...
Don't forget the hardest part is emigrating/getting a job.
Taking the bar is easy in comparison...
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N Sharma

Joined: 24 May 2005
Posts: 11
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Sun May 29, 2005 07:22 AM
Hi, this is amazing information.
I am an Indian, with an LLB from India. Wish to know if this find from smart guy can REALLY allow me to take the NY Bar or the CA Bar.
Thanks
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smartguy


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 97
Re: Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Thu Jun 02, 2005 09:14 PM
Hi, this is amazing information.
I am an Indian, with an LLB from India. Wish to know if this find from smart guy can REALLY allow me to take the NY Bar or the CA Bar.
Thanks

NY - may be, you'd have to submit your law diploma to NY Board of Law Examiners for evaluation. CA - for sure BUT only if you're admitted to practice law in India.
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kern

Joined: 02 Jun 2005
Posts: 2
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Fri Jun 03, 2005 08:01 PM
Hello everybody,

Congratulations and thank you to smart guy. His first posting is correct and very helpful.

In my personal job search experience in California passing the bar exam is not helpful for finding a lawyer job in good law firm. If they like you they will hire you anyway even without bar admission and ask you to pass the bar next time. The reason for that is procedure, procedure and again procedure. The big law firms follow strictly very formal procedure by hiring lawyers. No exceptions. They come in September in the law schools and interview only the top 20 % of the second year JD students. LL.M's are not in this group and are not interviewed. Then they offered them summer associate job for two months in the summer before the third year in the law school followed in most of the cases by job offer for the time after graduation and taking the bar exam.

So the bad news for the LL.M's is that LL.M and passing the bar do not guarantee any lawyer job in US. It will be smarter first to spot the job and then to pass the bar exam. You don't need LL.M. However if you have extra funds and one year, LL.M will be great experience, fun, studying and great new friends from all over the world.
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smartguy


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 97
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Fri Jun 03, 2005 11:52 PM
Golden words, Kem.
My smart and simple advice to international lawyers: don't waiste $30,000!
Come here, pass the Bar and start your own practice.
Be your own boss, grow and succeed and you'll have friends all over the world... for free :-)
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rockierzh

Joined: 12 Jun 2005
Posts: 3
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Mon Jun 13, 2005 06:25 AM
Hi, "smartguy", you are really "smart". I only have one question:

for foreign lawyers without exposure to the US legal system, how to prepare the CA bar exam? Please share with us some of your ideas in the bar review. Tons of thanks.
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smartguy


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 97
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Mon Jun 13, 2005 04:05 PM
You don't need any exposure to US law. I assume you are all here as smart as me. My advise is simple: purchase BarBri study materials and study 8 hours/day with it for 2-3 months and you'll pass this exam.Trust me: you don't have to have any practical legal experience in the US to pass this exam.
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rockierzh

Joined: 12 Jun 2005
Posts: 3
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Thu Jun 16, 2005 02:36 AM
I really hope so as I have heard about a lot of comments as to the difficulty of the bar exam, in particular the required practical experience. If all we need is just Barbri, life could be much more easier. Thanks a lot , man.
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IntLaw

Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 63
Re: Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.
Thu Jun 23, 2005 01:53 PM
This discussion board was so much informative and fun too at the same time. Thanks all and thanks SmartGuy for being the 'de facto' host.
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KarenGuilianna

Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 2
Peruvian Lawyer
Fri Jun 24, 2005 04:41 PM
Thank you smart guy for all the information in here. So, first, the CA Bar, after that MA Bar.. because I'm living in MA. Keep in touch.
KG
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olivia

Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 1
Re: Peruvian Lawyer
Fri Jun 24, 2005 08:28 PM
If I attain an LLB from the University of London through the 2 year full time external program, can I still be admitted to CA without an LLM? Thanks.
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Kira

Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 3
Re: Re: Peruvian Lawyer
Fri Jun 24, 2005 08:32 PM
Hi everyone,

I have a question: what if I have LLB (3 years) but I got it on-line (distance learning) - can I sit for BAR in any states?

Thanks a lot....
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smartguy


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 97
Re: Re: Re: Peruvian Lawyer
Fri Jun 24, 2005 11:58 PM
my answer to both of you ladies: remember CA admits foreign ATTORNEYS (no matter what foreign jurisdiction you're admitted in), NY admits foreign legal graduates with 3 years equivalent law degree from common law countries. Even if your law degree is from UK, I wouldn't be so sure about online (correspondence) studies and I incline to say no rather than yes just because it wouln't be substantially equivalent to 3 years JD degree program in any of the US ABA accredited law schools. You'd have to submit your diploma for evaluation to NY Board of Law Examiners. see more here: www.nybarexam.org/
I hope this helps.
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IntLaw

Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 63
Re: Re: Re: Re: Peruvian Lawyer
Sat Jun 25, 2005 07:55 AM
SmartGuy,

Thanks! One more question.

I am from India and India is a commonwealth country and the legal ed is based on British Common Law system. It is also a 3 year LLB course. Can I sit for NY bar with the Indian LLB degree?
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