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LLM in the international taxation

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demonic

Joined: 12 May 2005
Posts: 2
LLM in the international taxation
Fri May 13, 2005 06:21 PM
Hello,
I am looking for LMM studies in well recognized university.
After finishing the LLM program I am expecting to continue working for big4 or to get into an international corporation.

Anyone can recommend an university (I am thinking of Harvard or Leiden. Has any one experience with those two?
Which may give more opportunities? Maybe anyone can recommend other llm course in international tax?
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Leli

Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 6
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Mon May 16, 2005 02:46 PM
hey. i work as a senior consultant in EY tax department. from the next year im planning to do a MSC in Law and Accounting at LSE, which is basically the international tax law program (i do not have LLB so was not eligible to get tax LLM). I think LSE is quite good at tax law. or at least i hope so:)) when r u planning to do your postgrad study?
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demonic

Joined: 12 May 2005
Posts: 2
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Mon May 23, 2005 11:35 AM
Hi, Leli, thanks for the reply. It sounds interesting. I am planning to begin study in September 2006.
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Alexandra_K

Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 1
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Fri Nov 18, 2005 07:24 PM
I am currently studding in Leiden in the International Tax Centre. I consider this LLM program the best in Europe. If you want a relaxed program this is not your choice. The program is very demanding, very high quality, best professors in all spheres, pure international taxation, and no focus on domestic law of the specific countries (e.g. Holland). I will gladly answer your questions directly if you write me at akadet@yandex.ru.
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ivan2006


Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 312
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Fri Dec 02, 2005 06:32 PM
Hi, I think Alexandra is right. Personally, some friends of mine have graduated from the Intl Tax LLM at Leiden U and all of them loved it (albeit it is indeed demanding)! Among international tax professionals, Leiden is widely acknowledge as the most traditional program in Intl Tax, and is certainly a good choice. However, you may have into account other programs in other European Universities: Vienna (it has a great curriculum and excellent teachers - many of them teach at Leiden as well -, and could be considered as as good as Leiden), the European Tax College and Maastricht (it is a new program starting this year). In addition Queen Mary (London) is a good option: Prof. Philip Baker is one of the best living experts in Intl Law. Hope this advice helps.
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MarcelGH
Joined: 02 Dec 2005
Posts: 2
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Sat Dec 03, 2005 04:15 PM
Hi,
I see you mentioned the international tax program in Maastricht. Currently I am following this program, so I have a little inside info. The difference between Maastricht and the other universities is the learning approach. Whereas Leiden, European Tax College (Tilburg/Leuven) use lectures, Maastricht uses a case based approach (Problem Based Learning) very similar to Harvard Business School. I find it more practical than just the regular dry theory. The thing is that you get an actual real world case you have to analyse. This means that you don't focus on a certain subject matter, but you need to integrate a number of international tax law and european tax law subjects to solve the case. You are actually applying theory, so that is a great preparation for you future job as a tax advisor.
As for the difference between Leiden, Tilburg/Leuven and Vienna I can't find any. The teaching faculty is the same persons, so I think the reputation is equal. For those of you who might consider Harvard, NYU or Florida, please consider that the accent of those programs is one US international Tax and not on tax treaty/ European tax law as is the focus of the mentioned continental EU universities.
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Junior

Joined: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 6
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Thu Jan 25, 2007 04:26 PM
Hi guys, am seriously looking for a university, either in Europe or USA with a reputation on international tax law course. have looked at the programme for Vienna University(Austria) and appears beckonning.

i want to make an informed choice and wuold appreciate honest abservations and additions, if any. i have an LLB and is currently working for my country's(KENYA) Revenue Authority.

of geat importance would also be your advice on Scholarship information.

[Edited 25 Jan 2007 by Junior]
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johan

Joined: 10 Feb 2007
Posts: 7
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Sun Feb 11, 2007 11:50 AM
Hi Junior,

Regarding the US, let me tell you one thing. I am sure great universities, but the focus on most programs is US tax.

as far as Europe is concerned there are only two programs to be taken into account on international tax law: Vienna and Leiden. Both great programs, however I did my LLM in Vienna and would recommend everyone who is serviously interested in upgrading their tax knowledge for going there. Next to the academics, which is because of the outstanding professors of a very high level, social life is very important. Vienna is one of the most beautiful cities on this planet man!

The course: you have weekly 3 full days of course: from 8h30 - 17h30. The other days of the week are for preparing presentations, thesis, and preparation of the courses which is necessary. Exams: at end of every month about the lectures given that month.

The core program of the LLM remains the same every year, some course are changing depending on the theme of the thesis. The thesis is published in book if it obtains publishing level.

I would choose Vienna over Leiden everytime. Reason: high level lectures, good organisation of the program, helping faculty members, quality degree, LLM Alumni Club and meetings and, last but not least: Vienna: situated in centre of europe, great for city trips!

Regarding scholarship, you can try but very hard to get.

Any further questions? You can ask!
johan
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Junior

Joined: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 6
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Fri Feb 16, 2007 09:40 AM
Thanks Johan, am very grateful for ur advise. what specialty did u do ur LLM in? are u in a position to know the class capacity, both at vienna & Leiden? and the admission process, what do each focus on? my current focus is getting an admission. i graduated(LLB) about 3yrs ago with a 2nd class upper division Hons., passed bar exams & accordingly admitted to the bar.
For work experience, am currently in my second year of service with the revenue authority.
Would these enhance/hinder my chances of getting an admision?

While taking note of ur view on scholarship, i would appreciate if u could offer a further view on the scholarship offered by Vienna on the tax law program .

Finally, job prospects. my dream is to work in an international body/organisation, or in europe or US. This coz of the exposure and/or pecuniary advantages associated with these places.

I am aware that some of my questions could be difficult to answer, and i accordingly apologise in that event.
THANKS IN ADVANCE.

[Edited 16 Feb 2007 by Junior]
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johan

Joined: 10 Feb 2007
Posts: 7
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Fri Feb 16, 2007 04:52 PM
I don't really understand your question regarding the specialty of the LLM. I did the LLM in International Tax Law in Vienna. As regards, the class capacity we were with 25 during our year. I think that's pretty much the maximum of participants that can be admitted.

I checked the website of Vienna again, the program is really great. If I would not have done it, i would do it again, it is really an outstanding program.

The admission procedure....well it is a global evaluation of your academic curriculum and your professional experience. the fact that you work for the revenue authorities will certainly not hinder your admission, on the contrary I think. As you know, the number of places is limited and in the case of doubt, the date of the application will be of a factor as well. You still have until end of April for Vienna I believe, but I submitted mine in february. So don't wait too long.

For the scholarship, as I believe, you have to write an essay together with your application, on why you think you should get the scholarship. While financial capacities might play a role, as I look back on the previous" winners", the fact of being a young "talent", plays a role. The scholarship equals the tuition fee.

About teh process, you can go to the website: www.international-tax-law.at or send an email to Ms Ender if you have questions. You can find her email address on the website.

An LLM is certainly an added value on CV for jobs. You have a certain advantage compared to other candidates, but don't forget that tax law is law and law is connected to a territory. While having an LLM is an advantage, you will have to compete with the "locals".

cheers,
Johan
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johan

Joined: 10 Feb 2007
Posts: 7
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:09 PM
For the scholarship:

www2.wu-wien.ac.at/taxlaw/LLM/InfoApplicFormLLMSch…

deadline for scholarship 28 feb 2007.

Johan
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ghr

Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 1
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Sun Feb 25, 2007 04:41 AM
Hi I have sent in my application to Vienna and waiting impatiently to know the outcome. Does the university assist in finding accomodation etc? Is it easy for a non-german speaking foreigner to settle in? I was wondering if one is allowed to get some sort of practical experience after the course.
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johan

Joined: 10 Feb 2007
Posts: 7
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Mon Feb 26, 2007 04:48 PM
Hi if you are accepted the university will provide you with some addresses to contact in order to find accomodation. Piece of advice: be quick. Otherwise try to find somehting for a month or a couple of months and look for something during that period. What I did, I found somehting for 6 months. Some of the other students were in teh same situation, so we rented together an apartment for the other 6 months. Yes, it is very easy to settle in for non-German speakers. Viennese people are very friendly and open.

During teh course, it is possible to get a job at teh faculty as an assistant. that has been done in the past, however if there is no place, then there is no place...

Good Luck!

Johan
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Junior

Joined: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 6
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Wed Mar 14, 2007 10:08 AM
Johan, am grateful for the information and advise u gave me. am currently following up with Vienna for their 2008/09 programme. i could not make it this year due to financial and job related issues. i hope that by starting the application process early enuogh will enhance my chances of admission.
Junior



THANKS.
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basler52

Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 2
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Thu Dec 20, 2007 11:48 AM
The whole course seems very "academic, tehoretical" to me. Does the program contain "hard facts" about different taxes, such as VAT, corporate taxes, income taxes, or it just deals with the theoratical legal base of taxation. Can we bore into those kinds of taxes, or it just gives background information?
What do you think?
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koudiarov

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 11
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Thu Jan 10, 2008 08:45 PM
Having 5+ tax experience I would say that Leiden program is VERY practical with huge amount of cases which look like real situations, but very DEMANDING in schedule with some pressure. In Fundamentals there're some theoretical approach on some lectures... but it is necessary basics.
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johan

Joined: 10 Feb 2007
Posts: 7
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Fri Jan 11, 2008 11:25 AM
Hi,

Idem for Vienna program as I replied. Like you said, theory is necessary. If there is not theoretical background, understanding practice and case is not possible,

Kr
Johan
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koudiarov

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 11
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Fri Jan 11, 2008 08:48 PM
I compared cirricilum of Vienna and Leiden recently and would say that in Leiden we have more lectures and topic more covered in details. Some teachers are the same but we had more classes and topics are wider (based on our Tax Treaties course and Vienna analog).
In addition to lectures (which is I know is not available in Vienna as it has only lectures) we have workshops where practical cases are discussed, more things are added to understanding. For poor performing students we have tutorials where some complex things are discussed by TA for further understanding. For each lecture we have printed materials with articles and other materials to read in addition to OECD materials and VOGEL book. And besides every day before the lecture we should submit at 11 pm or earlier a written assignment on the topic to be presented on the lecture (usually the case).

[Edited 11 Jan 2008 by koudiarov]
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johan

Joined: 10 Feb 2007
Posts: 7
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Sat Jan 12, 2008 08:31 AM
Dear Koudiarov,

I don't understand your comparison and the purpose of it.......Did you attend both programs in order to make this analysis? What I know is that regarding the hours they are more or less the same, only there is a different spread. Anyway, I would not be able to do your comparison since I attended only the Vienna program. In any case, both programs are considered to be the best in Europe, I guess that if people are interested in one or the other program they can ask you regarding the Leiden LLM or me regarding the Vienna LLM.

Kind regards,
Johan
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MvH

Joined: 11 Feb 2008
Posts: 4
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:13 AM
Hi all,

I am participating in the LL.M programma in International and European Taxation of the European Tax College (www.europeantaxcollege.com), organised by Tilburg University and KU Leuven, and am very positive about its contents. Courses and seminars both cover the theoretical and the practical sides of international taxation. Furthermore, although the programme is demanding, it is well organised and time efficient.
Of course, I cannot compare with the programmes of Leiden and Vienna, so it is very interesting for me to see remarks about these other two LL.M. programmes.

Greetings,

MvH
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aditya 1

Joined: 12 Feb 2008
Posts: 4
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:20 AM
It was interesting to note your response about Vienna. I agree the LLM program offered by Vienna is one of the best. Would you know whether the university helps /assists in exploring job opportunities in Vienna or in Europe,after doing the course.
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aditya 1

Joined: 12 Feb 2008
Posts: 4
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:00 AM
Hi all,

I am participating in the LL.M programma in International and European Taxation of the European Tax College (www.europeantaxcollege.com), organised by Tilburg University and KU Leuven, and am very positive about its contents. Courses and seminars both cover the theoretical and the practical sides of international taxation. Furthermore, although the programme is demanding, it is well organised and time efficient.
Of course, I cannot compare with the programmes of Leiden and Vienna, so it is very interesting for me to see remarks about these other two LL.M. programmes.

Greetings,

MvH

Hi MvH,Wish you all the best. I am also interested pursuing LLM program in international tax. Could you elaborate what swayed your decision in favour of European tax college .Leiden and Vienna are more popular program.At least thats what I know.Are you aware of any assistance from college in finding any job opportunities i.e. any sor of campus interveiw,job fair. What sort of reputation does European tax college enjoy amongst Big four, large law firms and corporates.Thanks
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johan

Joined: 10 Feb 2007
Posts: 7
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Wed Feb 13, 2008 12:47 PM
Hi,

we sometimes get job openings via email, usually located in Vienna. German language skills are usually required. Some where able to work at the faculty.

But as such there are no job fairs or campus interviews.....

You cannot call it real assiatnce for finding a job. For that you are pretty much on your own.....
Johan
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Sylv519

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
Posts: 1
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Mon Feb 18, 2008 04:05 PM
I was thinking about applying for the LLM program in Vienna. I have a bachelors degree from a US university but I am finding it very difficult to find a job. I want to go back to school but most US universities are very expensive for a masters degree. I wanted to know if I finish this program in Vienna (I contacted them and they told me I can enroll with just finishing my Bachelors degree), are my chances for finding a job, here in the US, with a Big 4 accounting firm better? Or do US firms not consider a LLM from an European university that great? What are my chances for finding a job with a Big 4 in Vienna? Any help would be greatly appreciated!
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rokasd

Joined: 04 Mar 2008
Posts: 5
Re: LLM in the international taxation
Wed Mar 05, 2008 10:09 AM
Hi, everyone,

This year I am also applying to International Tax law programmes in Viena and Leiden. But I am only finishing my bachelor studies this year. So the problem is, that I am not sure, if I will be able to study at Leiden or Viena not having a lot of background in tax. Basically during my bachelor studies, I only had 3-4 tax related courses (2 of them at University Utrecht) and a 2 month internship at a local State Tax office. Could anyone give some opinions on that? Is it ok to go to these universities straight after bachelor or is it better to get some experience/background in tax law.

Rokas
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